Love of a lifetime

It was a nice, day in Detroit, Michigan even though it had started snowing, I sitting in my seat at the cementary as the ceremony for Evelyn Mercer's funeral proceeded, I should probably introduce myself first, my name is Shirin Dashti and I am a close friend of the Mercer's, her sons and I had grown up together, Jack and I were closer to age but out of all the boys I was closer to Bobby, Bobby Mercer was the oldest out of the four and very much the rebel known for his hot temper they called him the Michigan Mauler for Bobby was always looking for trouble, second oldest was Jeremiah or Jerry as we called him, use to be in the union and became a family man and for that he is the thinker and calm one out of the 4, next we have Angel, ex-hustler and pretty boy but he left for the marines but he was suppose to be coming home and last but not least we had Jack who was close to me as Bobby was, he was a wannabe rockstar and had gone a bit far but not that far, Jack had it the hardest for to show there love for him the guys pick on him a lot but those were the Mercer boys.

As I sat listening to the priests eulogy I looked over at Bobby who was sitting to my right with a tense look to him face, very grim, he hadn't said much to me but I knew him better then that, I knew he was hurting on the inside for he was very close to his mom as were the other guys but Bobby was the oldest so alot of the responsibilty's fell on him, as the priest mentioned that no one's sinful act would go unpunished I heard Bobby mutter something to made my blood run cold.

"Amen to that" he remarked, I sighed and he looked over at me as I looked at him with my eyebrow arched up but he just reached over for my hand and took it in his and squeezed comfortingly, I felt his hand shake a bit and I brought my other hand and placed it on the hand that held mine then the priest finished and we buried Evelyn Mercer, wonderful mother and friend, as we left the cementary I had a feeling like I was being watched by Evelyn right now, we left the cementary and went over to Jerry's, as we got there I saw the girls who when they spotted me came running over to me.

"Aunty Shirin! Aunty Sherry!" they remarked, Amelia making the last one for she couldn't quite say my name, Bobby watched me with his nieces then him and Jack came over.

"You must be Daniella?" asked Jack as he shook Daniella's hand then Bobby crouched down to Ruffus, petting him, "And you must be Amelia, nice dress Amelia" he remarked, making the girls laugh.

"I'm Amelia!" Amelia explained, Bobby looked at her and smiled, "I know, you probably dont remember me but I'm your uncle Bobby and this is cracker Jack" he remarked, placing a hand on Jack's shoulder and I started laughing as Jack looked at Bobby.

"Dont teach them that man" he muttered, Daniella looked at her uncles skeptically.

"Your not my uncles, your white" she said matter of factly, Bobby smiled at the how quickly she caught on, I crouched down next to the girls as Amelia turned to her sister.

"Grandma evey was white" she explained, Bobby smiled at his youngest niece.

"Thats right, were a different uncle, your grandma evey adopted us like she did you daddy" he explained, I loved to watch Bobby with kids for he was so good with them, then suddenly Amelia pointed straight.

"Your a policeman!" she announced as we saw to my dismay Green and someone I didn't recognize walk over and Green smiled at Amelia's announcement.

"Thats right and ya'll are under arrest" he ordered, the girls ran off as we all stood up to face Green and his no named partner.

"What about me Green? you going to arrest me to?" Bobby asked, Green faced Bobby as Jack and I stood next to him waiting to see what happened.

"Depending Bobby, you staying straight?" he asked, Bobby stared at him cautiously and observingly then finally he gave a crooked smile as he sighed.

"Straight-esh" he remarked, causing me to giggle, Green turned to Jack and I next, "Jack" he remarked as Jack nodded, "Green" Jack remarked, I bit my lip but I couldn't.

"Shirin! thats me" I announced as they laughed, even Bobby and thats what I was aming for Green turned to me and his eyes widened a bit, his mouth nearly dropping open.

"What? do I have something on my sweater?" I asked as I checked myself over but Green then got over his shock and grinned widely as he held his arms open.

"Shirin Dashti! I haven't seen you in years how ya been?" he asked as I gave him a hug then pulled back with a smile upon my face for it was good to see him.

"Been good Green, just busy with work, I got a few days off but it's not easy being a teacher for little kids but I love it" I explained, Green laughed and nodded then turned back to the guys.

"I'm really sorry about your mom guys! but I'm sure your mom was happy you made it back for her funeral" he remarked, I saw Bobby's jaw tighten.

"I didn't come back for no funeral" he replied, I felt myself sweat a bit at that comment for knowing Bobby he would go after the people that had done this to there mother, I saw Green and his partner share a look with one another.

"Thanks for the offer but we got this" Green's partner, Fowler admitted, Bobby nodded and looked around him.

"Ya I can see that when I drove up, Detroits finest has clean the place up" he remarked, I sighed and turned away for I didn't know how to handle all of this.

"Guys as much as I love to stand here and watch your machoness I'm going to go inside and see if Camille needs a hand with anything" I replied, I nodded at Fowler and Green then turned and walked inside leaving them to stare after me, I walked in the house and quickly walked to the bathroom for I was feeling a little sick to my stomach, all of this was to much for me to handle, whenever I got into a fight with my parents it was always the Mercer house I ran to where I felt safe and Evelyn was gone, I ran into the bathroom and shut the door behind me, sinking down to the ground as the tears cascaded down my cheek, I clutched my chest as if to push back the pain and ache that had begun to build inside of my heart, I dropped my head down to my knees and begun to sob at the unfairness of it all, I needed to figure a lot of stuff out.

Later on a night we drove back to the house where I was going to stay with the guys for they didn't want me staying at a hotel, I got out of the car as we all did, grabbing our luggage, as we walked up the steps the guys were cracking jokes at one another, as we came into the front of the house, Jerry switched the light on.

"Ya'll aint right leaving me out in the cold like this" remarked a voice, we turned to see Angel sitting on the chair outside and with no key to get in.

"Hey little brother! you asshole!" remarked Bobby, I laughed as Jerry mentioned that he should be ashamed of himself but Angel explained that he had missed his plane, as they all hugged each other I felt my eyes welling up again for we were all renuited once again, Angel spotted me standing there.

"Oh my god Sherry? that you?" he asked, I nodded as I walked over to him and he took me in a big hug lifting me off my feet as he brushed my hair back, he set me down and took my face in his hand, looking me over.

"You been ok? taking care of yourself?" he asked concernly, I looked up at him and saw that he was being serious, I gave him a comforting smile.

"I've been fine Angel! look at you! you guys have all gotten tall! not fair" I remarked, trying to get there attention on something else but me and it worked.

"Well what can we say girl its we have had out veggies while we were younger" cracked Bobby as he walked over and wrapped a arm around my shoulder, pulling me to him, I could feel his body heat radating off of him, as I looked at him I saw that he also looked concern, I had ended up in the hospital years back due to anorexia, the boys and Evelyn had been by my side this whole time and even though I had battled and won, the boys were still worried.

"Come on and get her out of the cold" remarked Jerry as he opened the door and we walked in, the coldness of Evelyn's absence seeping in the house, we looked around seeing that nothing had changed in the house, Angel sighed and headed for the kitchen.

"I'm hungry gonna get me something to eat, ya'll want anything?" Angel asked, Bobby sighed, "Naw I'm going to get some sleep, Jack you take your old room alright, Angel you too and Shirin you take my room, I'm going to go sleep in mom's room" he announced as we all headed up the stairs, Jerry stayed downstairs, I walked into Bobby's room and remembered the times that we would just lay out on this bed and talked, I smiled for I couldn't believe how much he's changed, he was settled but more angrier, I was slowly falling in love with my best friend, I smacked myself in the head for the irony of it, after setting my stuff down I went to go check on him and could hear his soft crying from the bathroom, I felt my eyes well up again at him trying to be strong but he was only human after all, I walked over to the door and cracked it open, he looked up at me through the mirror, I entered quickly and shut the door behind me, he turned to me and no words were said as I took him in my arms and held him close as he sobbed, I bit my lip to keep from crying myself for he needed me for support at the moment, I kissed his forehead as I comforted him then he quieted down, pulled back wiping his tears.

"She'll always be here Bobby, ya know that" I murmured, he nodded as he took the towel and wiped his tears with it then he looked at me with a unreadable expression, I arched my eyebrow in question, he walked over to me and dropped a kiss on my forehead.

"I know and thank you sweetheart, I needed that, my best friend" he remarked, I smiled and looked up at him as he tweeked my nose, I smiled and wrapped my arms around him once more, he set his chin on my head as we stood with one another, we could hear Jack in his room strumming on his guitar, Bobby pulled away reluctantly.

"Lets go see how Jack's doing" he remarked, I nodded and we walked out of the bathroom over to Jacks room, as we came in Bobby settled himself on the floor as I settled next to him, laying down facing the door and placing my head on his lap.

"You been crying in here you little fairy?" asked Bobby, I pinced him gently causing him to swat at me, Jack watched us with a amused look upon his face.

"Leave it alone man" he remarked, I looked up at Jack the best I could then shut my eyes as Bobby began playing with my hair.

"You still making a lot of racket on that thing?" I asked, I heard him chuckle and I smiled then I nearly purred in pleasure at the way Bobby was playing with my hair, with a bit of sensuality.

"Ya still making a lot of racket, to weird in mom's room?" he asked Bobby who groaned as he set his head on the edge of the bed then he looked down at me as he brushed my hair back.

"Way to weird, I mean she hasn't changed anything in this house, everythings the same" he remarked, we all looked at the door as Jerry came over, Bobby looked at Jerry questionly.

"Nothing just happy to see my brothers and one of my closes friends" he remarked, I smiled and Bobby looked at his brother in happiness but also in respect.

"I'm happy to see you too Jerry" he remarked, I looked at him as he looked down at me with a look that I have never seen before, a look that showed his whole heart and being which scared me because Bobby wasn't one to show his feelings that openly.

"I guess I'll go get a turkey, spend Thanksgiving together, at least try to act like a real family mom would of wanted that" remarked Jerry, we nodded but for some reason Bobby and I couldn't take our eyes off one another then we looked to see Angel come over looking like he was going out.

"Where do you think your going?" asked Jerry, Bobby looked at me rolling his eyes as I giggled then Bobby started laughing and looked at Angel.

"Its a little heavy in there, gonna go out and get me some freash air" he answered, we all started laughing, Bobby was practically dying with laughter.

"Your full of shit man! you can smell that ass from down the street huh?" he remarked, I was laughing so hard I was practically crying, Angel looked at Bobby.

"What?" he asked, Bobby looked over at me, "Ya know what! with la vida loca!" he remarked, Angel looked shocked that we could think such a thing.

"I dont know what your talking about! aint nobody going to go get la vida loca!" he protested, I laughed clutching my stomach.

"She got a boyfriend" remarked Jerry matter of factly, Bobby looked over again, "She got a boyfriend, she got hard dick in her right now, she's screaming somebody else's name and the last thing she's thinking about is your black ass! leave it alone man!" he remarked, as he turned back to me causing Jack to bust out laughing, I realized that it was time to go to bed, I got up from Bobby's lap not wanting to.

"All right guys I'm going to go to bed, I'm tired as all hell" I remarked, the all started to say there goodnights.

"I cant believe this, I'm telling ya'll right now I'm not going to see that girl and I'm not!" he concluded, I walked past him and dropped a kiss upon his cheek.

"Sure your not Angel, goodnight guys!" I remarked, they called out there goodnights one more time as I walked into Bobby's room, closing the door then sliding to the floor at how confusing my feelings for my best friend had becomed, I wanted to figure this all out and I wondered if I was feeling emotional because of Evelyn's death, I shook my head and figured that I just needed some sleep, so I went over to the bed and laid down, slowly falling asleep.

A little in the night...

It was a cold, dark night as I walked along the streets, as I looked I saw that I was standing in front of the same liqour store that Evelyn was shot out, I walked in and saw Evelyn talking to a little boy about not shoplifting, as I stood frozen I couldn't help smiling for thats how Evelyn was always helping everyone, finally the boy ran off after he was told to then as the little boy left, Evelyn turned to the guy behind the counter with a smile.

"You handled that beautifully, he's really not a bad kid, he just needs a older brother" she remarked, I smiled because I knew that she was thinking of her boys, as she looked at the turkey the door suddenly slammed open and two guys came running in, I gasped and called out a warning to Evelyn but she didn't hear me and as I watched helpless as they shot the guy behind the counter, I ran over to Evelyn to push her out of the way and my hands went right through her and I fell to the floor, shaken and scared to death I watched as Evelyn stand in front of them as they held the gun to her, she eyed them fearfully but yet calmly.

"May god save your souls" she remarked, then they shot her twice, I screamed but they didn't hear me as they quickly ran out of the store, I ran to Evelyn and dropped to my knee's next to her as she slowly died, I took her in my arms begging her not to die, I needed her, the boys needed her then suddenly she turned to me and placed a solid hand upon my face.

"S-Shirin I w-want y-y-you to t-t-take care of my b-boys, a-all of t-t-them, espically B-Bobby" she gasped as she struggled to breathe then she slipped away, I just stared down at her helpless not knowing what to do, then I broke down and sobbed, rocking back and forth as she had already died but she told me in her way that she wanted me to take care of the guys, she didn't think about herself just about her sons, she always thought about everyone but herself, feeling lost and alone, I just sat there with her dead body in my arms, wailing in complete sorrow but knowing that there was going to be a reckoning.

Back to reality...

I sat up gasping, it was a dream just a awful bad dream but it wasn't a dream for Evelyn had died but she would always be here with us, I pressed a trembling hand to my head as I tried to calm myself down, I felt my tank top a little damp for I had sweated so much, I dropped my head down in my hands, taking in a deep breath then I threw my covers back regardless of how cold it was then got up from bed, suddenly not tired anymore, I pulled my hair out of the ponytail that I had it in and shook my hair out letting it fall all around me in waves then slowly trudged downstairs needing some water, as I blindly walked down the stairs I heard a shuffle, I froze not knowing who was down here, then I saw the person slumped down sitting on the couch and I knew it was Bobby, walking closer to him his head came up and I saw that it was him, I kneeled in front of him as he looked at me with sorrow filled eyes.

"What are you doing up Bobby?" I asked, he looked at me with a look that said that I should know, chuckling I set my head on his knee as he smoothed my hair down.

"What about you Shirin? what are you doing up?" he asked, I sighed then got up and settled myself next to him on the couch, he reached for me and pulled me to him, I placed my head on his chest as we sat there in silence.

"I-I had a bad dream and I couldn't sleep, so I came down here to get some water" I murmured in explanation, he nodded then slowly laid us out on the couch and there in my best friends arms I fell asleep as did he.

In the morning I heard yelling and I opened my eyes to hear Bobby and Angel yelling as Jerry laughed watching them, I could smell turkey cooking and I knew that Jack was cooking, I laid back to see Bobby and Angel arguing.

"Loco uno is not staying in this house!" ordered Bobby, Angel didn't like that, "Bullshit Bobby!" he remarked, I bit my lip to keep from laughing outloud but Jerry was already past that stage.

"I dont care, la vida loca aint staying one more night in this house! tell her to get her stuff..." he was cut off, "What is this your house Bobby?" asked Angel, I looked at Jerry who saw that I was awake and gestured me over.

"This aint no homeless shelter!" remarked Bobby, Angel shook his head then I saw a pretty brunette come walking halfway down the stairs.

"Hey Bobby!" she remarked, going off in spanish, Bobby just stared at her as Angel wentover telling her that he would take care of it, I placed my head on Jerry's shoulder as I died of laughter.

"Was I talking in spanish? no I dont think so, vamino!" he ordered, Angel followed him back in the family room, "See thats what I'm talking about man, dont talk to my girl like that" he remarked, Bobby looked at Angel in complete annoyance.

"She wasn't your girl yesterday, she had another man so I'm confused, look lets just play some fucking turkey cup!" he remarked, hitting the puck with his stick, I got up and walked over to Angel giving him a big hug hello then I walked over to Bobby who smiled at me, I wrapped my arms around him as he playfully dipped me then pulled me back up.

"Good morning sweetheart" he remarked, I nodded and dropped a kiss on his cheek then went to go upstairs to change so I could outleast look decent, I changed into a low cut black shirt and black jeans as I let my hair flow around my shoulders then came downstairs and entered the kitchen.

"Hey Jack need any help in here?" I asked, but he turned to me and shook his head, I gave him a hug as he dropped a brotherly kiss on my cheek.

"You ok?" he asked, I nodded but didn't look him in the eye, I could hear the guys goofing around and turned to see that Angel was throwing little discs at Bobby and Jerry.

"Do that again and watch what happens" remarked Jerry, Angel looked at his big brother with mock fear, "What are you going to do? big ass teeth, bite me!" he concluded then snapped his teeth in emphasis, we all started laughing.

"You do got some big ass teeth Jerry" remarked Bobby laughing, Angel then threw another disc at him then turned away, Jerry nodded then got up hitting him in the head, Bobby cheered as Angel turned to him and tackled him.

"The gorgous black girls of wrestling, Nitro and Midnight, Nitro got Midnight in a head lock! get him Jerry!" announced Bobby, as Jerry pinned Angel to the ground, I watched in amusement.

"Midnight is trying to get up but Nitro's on him, get him Nitro!" Bobby cracked, I shook my head but this was how these boys were like, Jack signaled me that the turkey was done.

"Ok guys lunch is ready!" I announced, Bobby quickly got up as the others came over and we gathered around the table, I looked at the guys that meant the world to me then we held hands saying grace then after we were done we sat down the eat, we all looked over at the empty seat that was Evelyn's, with last nights dream in my mind it was hard for me to sit and eat as if sensing that Bobby set his hand on my knee for a second giving it a quick squeeze as I smiled up at him lovingly, he looked like he was in a far off world of his own and I knew that they were all thinking of Evelyn, after sitting there eating in silence, Bobby threw his napkin on the table and stood up.

"To hell with this man, lets go get a pick up game, I want to see some tight sticks and hard passes" he remarked, we all looked up at him as Angel shook his head.

"Its to cold I didn't come all of the way out here to play no hockey" he remarked, Bobby didn't want to hear that, he walked away with his drink as we sat there for a bit.

"Come on ladies! I wanna see some fucking skills!" he remarked, I nodded then got up pulling Angel up with me as we went to go change and go play some hockey.

As we got in the rink it was like old times all over again, we played against some guys we didn't know to well, I laughed as Bobby knocked Jerry's phone out of his hand, I stepped out because after awhile I was getting sick, I sat out breathing heavily and I knew it had nothing to do with my anorexia because I had overcomed that, it was probably the lose of Evelyn.

"Shirin honey dont worry about me so much" remarked a familar voice, startled I looked up and saw Evelyn sitting there smiling at me, I just gaped at her because she looked like she did the last time I saw her.

"E-Evelyn what are...is that really you?" I asked, not believing but hoping that she really was there, she smiled at me and placed her hand on mine.

"I want you to be happy, you are just the girl that Bobby needs and I know you do love him just as much as he loves you and trust me honey he does love you" she remarked, I looked at her then over at Bobby who was cheering Jack on then turned back to her and she had disappeared, I swallowed the lump in my throat.

"I'll take care of him Evelyn, I promise" I murmured, then I saw the guys come skating over, I saw the huge grin on Bobby's face and I took Evelyn's words to heart, he needed me regardless of him saying he didn't, he came over and sat next to me.

"You ok hun?" he asked, I looked at him and rested my head on his shoulder and sighed, "Ya Bobby I'm ok" I remarked, then the guys came over and we left to go over to the lawyers office, as we sat there Mr.Bradford went over the fact that it must be hard going through the finances went your heart still greives for a loved one, well lets just say we got what we came for as we finished up Jerry said that he had something to show us, as we drove to a abandoned warehouse I recognized it as the same place where I had gotten in my first fight at, I turned to Jerry with a smile.

"Well you sure know how to bring on the memories dont ya?" I asked, they all looked at me questioningly and I laughed, pointed at the building.

"The first time I got into a fight was here, I beat her ass may I add" I remarked, they all laughed and cheered, we walked inside and mentioned the condition on the building, Jerry said that they were going to make lavish offices and store fronts, after watching and looking Bobby said something that we all agreed to.

"Lets go get a real drink" he said, finishing off his beer and throwing it aside shattering it on the ground, I smiled at that one and we all left to go to the bar, as we sat at the bar, Johnny poured us all shots of whiskey and we held it up for a toast.

"A toast to Evelyn Mercer! the best mother four degenerated basterds ever had!" he toasted, we clicked our glasses and threw down the shots, I shook my head at the intensity of it, Bobby looked at me quite impressed and shocked, I looked at him.

"W-what? you think a girl like me cant drink? man my first drink was with you Bobby Mercer! you know that!" I remarked, he laughed as the other guys cheered, Bobby pulled me to him and dropped a kiss on my forehead.

"Pour me and my brothers another shot and a nice warm milk for my little sister here" he remarked, putting a arm around Jack's shoulder as we laughed.

"Man I will drink you under the table" replied Jack, Bobby patted Jack on the, "Were not talking about sperm Jack this is whiskey" he reamarked, I felt my head start to pound a bit but I looked at Johnny who chuckled at the boys anticts then turned to me.

"Can I have a white wine? zinfindeal?" I asked, he nodded and poured me a glass, I snatched it up and we walked over to a table and sat down as the guys got there drink, I drained my wine as the guys watched me with wide eyes, once again I finished and slammed my glass on the table and to the guys.

"Look can a girl drink without having at least 4 pair of eyes looking at her?" I asked, the guys shared a look with one another and I caught Bobby sighing, I felt my annoyance go up.

"You got something to say Bobby Mercer?" I asked, he looked at me and I saw that I was trying his patience, he shook his head and sat back in his chair then I looked at Jack as he drank his drink.

"Jack drinks jack, Jack drinks jack" he remarked as he drank, I couldn't help but chuckle and as they saw me laugh they loosed up but I saw that Bobby was a bit peeved.

"Thats your brother" Jerry pointed out to Bobby who was shaking his head at his brothers anticts, "Ya Jack licks ass crack and ball sack" he remarked, Jack glared at Bobby.

"Jack doesn't lick ass crack and ball sack, Jack likes boobs, Jacks got fans, Jacks got lots of fans" he remarked, I groaned out a laugh at his point.

"Will you shut up man" remarked Angel, we laughed and I watched as Bobby and Jerry spoke to one another, the intense pounding in my head was becoming to much and I shook my head, groaning.

"Hey guys I'm really sorry about you mom, goddamn gangs, worms" Johnny relieved, forgetting the pounding in my head I turned to him at what he had just said, suddenly my blood ran cold as I turned to Bobby who's face hardened as he got into his fighting mode.

"Which gang Johnny G?" he asked, Jerry groaned turned to Bobby, "Here we go! mom always said that as smart as Bobby was he never wants to think" he remarked, I looked at Bobby as he looked at me, shaking my head I got up from my seat.

"If you want to go chase after these punks then by all mean go ahead!" I remarked, I went to walkaway when I felt my head just spin and I felt someones arms around me, catching me as I suddenly blacked out and slipped into oblivon.

I heard voices above me as I struggled to open my eyes, "Bobby I think she's waking up" said Angel, least it sounded like Angel as I groaned and finally my eyes fluttered open, I groaned again at the bright light but as I opened my eyes I saw Angel, Jerry, Johnny and Jack standing over me worried reflecting their eyes, I gave them a brave smile.

"Jesus Shirin you scared the fuck out of us" remarked Jack, I saw that he was terrified, I took his hand and squeezed then I looked around for Bobby.

"I'm right here baby" he murmured, I looked up into his concerned blue eyes as he looked down at me worriedly, I realized that it was head that I was resting my head on, I groaned.

"God what the hell happened?" I asked, Bobby helped me sit up as I leaned against his strong chest for support and he wrapped his arm around me.

"You fainted, what happened? you were ok getting up to leave when you just started swaying and then you slide for the floor and I had to jump up and catch you before you hit the floor" he explained, I pressed a hand to my head and felt it pounding still but not as intense.

"M-my head is pounding and I got dizzy, maybe its just lack of sleep, look Bobby I know that this is gonna sound shocking but go after these punks, find out who did this to your mom" I remarked, he looked at me his eyes windening in shock as was the other guys.

"Jerry can take me home and I'll go rest that is if its alright?" I wondered, Jerry nodded as did the other guys, Angel looked at me sternly and helped me up.

"Jerry is gonna take you home and get your ass in bed ya hear me?" he asked, I giggled and saluted him, "Aye ya sir! whatever you say but I want you guys to becareful" I ordered, he nodded I turned to Jack and hugged him tightly and I could hear him breathe heavily.

"I'm alright Jackie, I swear" I murmured, he nodded and I dropped a kiss on his cheek then I turned to Bobby, the man that I loved more then my own life, he yanked me in his arms.

"Why didn't you say anything?" he asked, I shrugged as I hugged him tightly but he clutched me to him, I looked a little confused and wondered why he suddenly was all huggy with me, he pressed a loving kiss to my forehead but then he realized who was watching and backed off a bit